This week on the OKRs Q&A Podcast, host Tim Meinhardt, Jeff Sweeney (Senior OKR Consultant with Atruity), and Stephanie Meinhardt (Director of Business Development for Atruity) discuss how to save your OKR program from the numerous challenges seen with OKR Adoption & Buy-In. This episode is the second in a series of five episodes (featuring numerous members of the Atruity team) discussing how to save your OKR program from the five largest OKR program challenges. All of these hidden challenges impact the success of an OKR program long term and every OKR program will face them at one time or another.
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Tim Meinhardt:
Welcome everyone to another exciting episode of the OKRs Q&A Podcast, also known as the OKR Corral, where OKR insight is the king. I’m your host, Tim Meinhardt, President and CEO of Atruity, an OKR consultancy headquartered in our nation’s capital.
Before we begin, if you’re an OKR fan and enjoy our podcast, please subscribe, leave a review, and explore our website at www.atruity1.com. And finally, should you have a burning question you’d like addressed in future episodes, please drop us a note at contact@atruity1.com.
In this exciting episode, we’re heading a little off script and are actually doing another OKR Corral featuring a couple of Atruity team members and myself. Today’s topic is Part Two of a larger five-part OKR Corral series which we’ll be doing over the next several months covering the five largest hidden challenges in running a successful OKR program long-term. You know, building a resilient and successful OKR program takes persistence, proven management practices, and solid guidance from OKR experts like us at Atruity. So if you’re struggling with this issue mentioned in this episode, or you are looking for OKR experts to help guide your organization through certified training, OKR implementation, or OKR program management, don’t be afraid to reach out to our team. Just email us at contact@atruity1.com. So please, every, grab that cup of coffee, plug in those earbuds, and enjoy a rare OKR Corral with our Atruity team.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
Hi, everyone, and welcome back to another fun and exciting episode of the OKRs Q&A Podcast. This quarter, we will be releasing an e-book discussing the five hidden challenges that every organization will face with their OKR program at some point or another. Today, we’re going to be discussing the second hidden challenge—adoption and buy in. Just as we did for part one, this episode will feature Tim Meinhardt, the normal host of OKRs Q&A and CEO of Atruity; Jeff Sweeney, a Senior OKR Consultant for Atruity; and myself, Stephanie Meinhardt, Director of Business Development for Atruity. So let’s dive in. So, Jeff, why is OKR adoption and buy in so challenging?
Jeff Sweeney:
Well, Stephanie, a great question, and I’m glad to be back on the podcast. I think one of the big reasons why OKR adoption and buy in is so challenging is really that there’s no resources out in the marketplace to really explain how to do it in terms of running a successful program. We don’t really see many articles written about it. There’s tons of great books that say how great OKRs are, and they’re really helpful to get that initial excitement, but very little saying, “Okay, now that you’re ready to go with OKR, how do I actually implement this?” The thing to realize, especially to this point, is that every company is unique. Every company has different challenges, different struggles. How they will go about OKR is going to be a little bit different. So because every company has their own unique starting point, it’s important to realize that every company is going to implement and roll out OKRs in a slightly varied way. So, Tim, I know that you talk a little bit about pilot programs and how companies can roll these programs out, how they can begin with that initial buy in stage. What are your thoughts on it, Tim?
Tim Meinhardt:
Well, you know, the pilot programs will come up all the time in talking to people. And, you know, I’m not a big advocate of a pilot program. And what I am an advocate of are lighthouse programs. And lighthouse programs, simply put, is committing to a particular area or organization within your organization. And I like to say it’s the highest performing team or one that’s really performing well, and then putting the program in there first. Now, what’s the difference really between a pilot program and a lighthouse program? A pilot program is a test. “Oh, do we like it? Is it really for us?” Lighthouse is more of a committed program. “We’re going to put this in and we’re going to see how it works.” So it’s sometimes almost a frame of mind between the difference between a pilot and a lighthouse, but we like to see those put in the highest performing team and if that’s really where you’d like to go. You know, we also believe very strongly in literally starting out with the major department heads, seeing how it goes, see if it really is making sense. Are they getting that true alignment horizontally? Because as this goes throughout the organization, what you’ll find is you’re going to have not only vertical alignment, but truly horizontal alignment is that secret sauce.
Secondly, and to that point, you know, you really only get and have a limited amount of time to get buy in before people are generally no longer interested or want to participate in that program. And, you know, we’re brought in to organizations that their OKR program is on what I would call life support at times. And it is more challenging to be able to actually get folks back interested in the program, create all the things that we’re going to talk about later in this podcast in order to reestablish what we’re hoping to accomplish, which is that adoption and buy in, not only for the short term, but for the long term.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
I will say to Tim’s point, when we have done triage programs to programs that Tim just mentioned, were on life support, we have been able to bring them back to life using the solutions that we’re going to mention later on in this podcast, because once OKR programs are implemented well and everyone’s on the same page, you would be surprised how much by in comes back because everyone’s excited again.
Tim Meinhardt:
Great point, Stephanie.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
Thanks, Tim. So what do you think is the first step to actually gaining adoption and buy in?
Tim Meinhardt:
Well, it’s the big question, you know, and so, I believe that you need to have a better understanding of how all this is done. You know, when we walk into organizations, they can conceptually understand fairly quickly what an OKR is all about, what is objective is, what a key result is. “Hey, I’ve watched a video or two,” but it’s that how that Jeff mentioned earlier that really begins to set a program toward a particular direction. And, you know, I’m a firm believer if you’re not really sure where you’re going, any road is going to take you there. So having that proven framework, I think, is just a great first step to gaining that adoption and buy in.
Jeff Sweeney:
So when adopting an OKR program and really generating that excitement for the team, really creating that buy in, I think one of the most important lessons is really helping to educate people on why to adopt a new goal setting strategy. And there’s a number of unique facets about OKRs that really help transform an organization to make it a lot more efficient, make it a lot more agile. So when successfully implementing and adopting an OKR program, it should actually help to decrease the total number of meetings you guys have. It shouldn’t be “okay, let’s add more meetings around OKRs,” but OKR becomes a common focus in all of your meetings. Because ultimately you start to believe in the work you’re doing. Everything is around your OKRs. What are the one or two things that we can do to make our organization great? OKRs should help to really almost tunnel vision onto what are the most important priorities that we can have? Because it’s really not about doing everything, it’s about picking the really few topics, the focuses that are going to help the organization achieve greatness.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah. You know, I use a great word—it’s WIIFM. What’s in it for me? I mean, here we are walking into this thing. It’s management flavor of the month. Oh, gosh. You know, so the sooner and Jeff, to your point, the sooner we can be able to offer them some type of anchor to buoy the boat a little bit, and they can begin to slowly understand their WIIFM question because it always boils down to “what’s in it for me?” And, you know, I was having this discussion yesterday with the gentleman at lunch and, you know, we were talking about the OKR program in general. And you know, why it is so powerful. And, you know, we talk about, you know, top down, but sometimes that bottom up feeling, letting people know that they’re going to make a difference.
First off, they’re going to be able to see what the organization is trying to accomplish. But giving them that sense of, “Hey, if this is going to be the greatest quarter you’ve ever had, what is it that you would like to be able to get accomplished?” Throw away all of the restrictions for a second. Let’s just dream a little bit about what that outcome begins to look like 90 days from now. And I think that’s when you start talking about the possibilities that you get people actually excited, because that excitement that we want to see is what we do as an organization, is to try to build that excitement, and then prove it to them. Okay, so we’re proving that WIIFM, and that’s where you get that really really excited feeling, and honestly, that’s where you start getting the buy in. And so I think it’s really important to generate that excitement, as you mentioned, Jeff.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
I agree. And I think the excitement is completely underrated. I don’t think it’s talked about enough. I mean, OKRs are coming in to help. And the sooner you can talk about it, the sooner people get excited and they’re on the same page. And then you don’t have as many challenges down the road because everyone’s really pumped.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yup.
Jeff Sweeney:
I wish that anyone adopting an OKR program today could actually see what it would mean for all of their staff 90 days from now. I’ve been able to see over the course of time with consulting, with working with people, they become way more confident in their work. They’re a lot more proud. I’ve seen quiet people become some of the biggest extroverts because they’re really excited to be doing what they’re doing. They actually see the impact behind what they do. So I really think that point is so exceptional. I wish I could give it to people in advance because they would see the benefit just immediately.
Tim Meinhardt:
I have Jeff, and to that point, I’m smiling, because I’ve had so many instances where you’re going to encounter that naysayer going in. And yet when that light bulb switches and they become an advocate, it is the most unique experience when they’ve realized this is a benefit to not only to me what’s in it for me, but what’s in it for the company and why wise I see it. And maybe they didn’t see it at first. So a great, great conversation here.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
Great answers, everyone. And I couldn’t agree more about the excitement. And I do wish we could bottle it up and give it to people pre-program because I think you would get so many more people on board if they could just feel the excitement. So what are some solutions that we can give today on the podcast to help organizations succeed with better buy in and adoption? Tim, what do you think?
Tim Meinhardt:
You really need executive buy in for the program. Look, it’s uncomfortable at first. A lot of people do question it. They’re going to look for ways to shoot it down because of the WIIFM. I don’t know what it’s in for me, but I’m already busy enough. I don’t need something new. So the executive buy in is critical because, look, this is really hard work that we do. When you set somebody—and we’re going to talk about North Stars in a second—but when you start doing these facilitated activities, they’re hard. People are tired when they’re done and they don’t necessarily think like, “Why do we have to do this?” So I think getting that executive buy in so that we know these are the right steps to do is a big deal. Jeff, what do you think? What else kind of flows into what’s truly important?
Jeff Sweeney:
Well, Tim, you’re reading my mind. You brought up North Stars, and I think this is one of the most important things in terms of helping organizations succeed. When we talk about buy in, it’s ultimately about impact for me. And North Stars are the way that we drive the right impact. I think that’s really important is it’s not just about what can we achieve, but are we achieving the right things? And North Stars is ultimately your guiding star. “What is your mission?” And I know not every company has a mission. Many have a mission that is on paper that they wrote ten years ago. The first thing that I want to make sure when I’m meeting with the company to look at OKR adoption is what is the company’s mission and ultimately, going to your point with executive buy in, does everyone in the room agree with that mission? Are we all unified together on the same page, driving toward the same impact? Because I think when you can begin first with having full executive buy in, everyone at the top says “This is what we’re going to do, this is the right path.” And then making sure you actually have that right path. At the end of the day, this is where we want to be. Having that North Star, having that mission, is going to already energize this program. It’s going to make sure that everyone at the top is excited. But it also ensures that when we begin rolling out OKRs, when we begin with our teams, our departments, everyone can see the right direction. Everyone knows where we’re going.
Tim Meinhardt:
Before we continue with the interview. We’d like to tell you a little bit about Atruity.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
At Atruity we understand the challenge of implementing a successful OKR program. While the methodology may be straightforward and easy to understand, the implementation and execution of the program can seem daunting. Your team is concerned because you’re unsure how to properly implement or manage your OKR program. You are not alone. This is where Atruity comes in. We know how to implement an OKR program and are experts in OKR implementation and management. By using our proven methods and implementation structure, we can help you to successfully implement OKRs within your organization in as little as 30 days. If your organization is considering implementing OKRs or struggling with the management of the program, do not hesitate to reach out to us at contact@atruity1.com. Remember, no plan succeeds on its own—execution is everything.
Tim Meinhardt:
Jeff, great point here. And I’m going to add a story—I’ve got some stories today, and so I want to tie in something to the vision and the mission and the culture. I met with a private equity group yesterday and we were talking about OKRs and how it fits into their unique management program, which is fantastic. First thing that we do is we look at the mission, vision, and culture of the organization. And do they have this written down? Do people understand the why and where they’re going.
The second piece that begins to tie this all together are the long term objectives. Now, we know from our research that long term objectives, if they’re established and written down, exponentially help a company succeed versus ones that don’t. Now, this hit a light bulb with this particular partner in this private equity firm. And he said “Oh, my gosh, this is fantastic because we want them to get from this point here to that point there in five years.” And it’s the long term objectives. And I said, “yes, this is absolutely what you want to have written down so that everybody understands where we’re heading here over the next several years.” And then, Jeff, as you said from there, those North stars allow us then to look at what it is that we need to do this year and then begin to break it down even further and get that crystal focus that everyone can get on board with and execute, which is critical for our success.
You know, I want to touch on the third one. We’ve talked about this. I’ve talked, I’ve done podcasts, I’ve done webinars, and we wrote our e-book. And, by the way, download our Seven Cs book. It’s fantastic. It’s in our podcast notes here today. And I think it’s just a high level viewpoint that I think you want to be able to have when you’re implementing a successful OKR program. Let me touch on them just briefly. Okay. First C-suite. We’ve mentioned that you’ve got to have that C-suite buy in that Jeff talked about.
Secondly, the champion, you need to have somebody running this program. Guess what? Doesn’t run on its own. It’s an agile based arrangement where we’re going to set, and we believe you reset every quarter. So unless you have somebody doing that, notoriously people say, “Hey, we’re really busy. Gosh, we forgot this quarter.” You know, so you need somebody actually running that program. And to that point, and Jeff touched upon this also, was you need somebody evangelizing this program, somebody that’s going to stand up and be that champion and say, “We’re doing great stuff.” Okay, and they inspire people and they want to tell stories and they want to get anybody else that’s having some success with it to talk a little bit about it in their program. That’s how you build that excitement. That’s where people begin to adopt it. You get that common sense of language. One of these days, we’ll actually have conversation again over a water cooler. So I think it’s really, truly important that you have the right champion.
Then we talk about community a little bit and just to briefly touch on that community, is so important because you are part of a team of teams. And so, you know, the whole community is trying to lift up and move the organization in its direction that it says it really needs to get to this quarter and this year because it supports that long term objective and the mission and vision of the organization.
Next is collaboration. And we touch on that, and we’ve talked in and out about collaboration continuously. And I want to touch on this briefly because good buy in and adoption is when it’s done collaboratively. And as I like to say, it was “what’s in it for me?” So if I have input, okay, if I have the ability to have my say in not only what we’re trying to accomplish, but doing it in a collaborative way with either my boss above me or my folks that are working with me as a team. When we all decide together, think of the power that is. And it reminds me of the John Doerr story just briefly, where he talks about the running of a marathon. If his doctor told him to run a marathon, well, it’s not really what he wanted to do. But what’s in it for me? I’m going to run that marathon. And so he’s chosen himself to be a singular collaborator in making his own particular key result. So I believe in collaboration. I think it’s good. I also have talked ad nauseam, people hear me talk about the two pizza rule, that you really don’t want to have more people to come up with it than can eat two pizzas. I always tell people I can eat a lot of pizza. So collaboration is a big deal.
Next is communication. And really, we touch on this. You know, it’s one thing to have an OKR program, and some people put OKR software in and that’s fine. And some people love Slack, but really it’s that human communication that you have. We believe in setting things up and having that touch meeting, whether it’s a check in meeting every week, every other week. It’s quick, it’s fast. But that type of communication and feedback and recognition, now I’ll put that all under communication, is really what’s critically important to adoption because everyone’s busting their tail to do the best they can. Well, think about that for a second, okay? If you’re really busting it wouldn’t you want someone to recognize that? And so we believe in good, solid communication.
And we also believe in consistency. So it’s one thing to do it every once in a while. It’s one thing to be consistent. You know, the difference between an amateur and a professional golfer is the amateur does it every once in a while, the professional is consistent about his efforts, the things that he does, and we need to be the same way as professionals. We need to be consistent because that consistency brings and breeds familiarity. Familiarity breeds comfort. Comfort breeds adoption.
And then the last one, as I talk about; its commitment. Look, this isn’t easy, especially when you first get started. Everyone and anyone that is listening to my program that’s been involved with me during the last several years has known that first meeting that they check in, it’s clumsy. “I’m not sure how to do that. I don’t know how to really how to write a good OKR. I think I do. I’m unsure about myself.” So it’s that commitment to just going through that little bit of rough spot that I think is really, truly important and knowing that, okay, that’s where you’re going to build that adoption.
Jeff Sweeney:
Hey, Tim, I think those are really great points and I really do recommend everyone to really download The Seven Cs as they take a look. I’m sure they’ll come up with their own seven Cs. I’m sure you’ve had people suggest a few C’s to you, Tim.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yes, and there are more C’s. But we really liked those when we wrote our little e-book. But yes, Jeff, you’re right. You could find more C words as well.
Jeff Sweeney:
Well, speaking of which, Tim, I’m actually going to I’m going to talk about two more Cs. So I’m going to talk about centralization and center of excellence for a second and ultimately getting away from the C’s for a bit. What I want to transition to, and I think is important, is what we’ve discussed so far are a lot of how do we manage concepts, how do we manage people? Some of the most important parts of the program that we’ve discussed, and areas that I don’t think people spend enough time is managing resources. So what I what I really look at when it comes to adoption and buy in, and when we go back to the hidden challenge, I don’t think people take enough time to think about what are the resources that people are going to be using to learn about OKRs? And not just for the first time, but if a new employee comes in, are they going to have the same experience, the same resources? If for, God forbid, your program manager leaves and you have to hire a new one, is it going to be consistent? Another C.
So I look at the resources of running a successful OKR program. A lot of it goes into what we do at Atruity, which we call the Center of Excellence, and it’s the idea of having a centralized resource hub that ensures that when you are running a successful OKR program that everyone has the same experience. Tim, one of the favorite exercises we do in the program is when we show one of our videos from John Doerr, we ask everyone, what are their one or two key takeaways? And I think it’s so powerful because what I learned from this and what I’ve seen you mention this as well, is that everyone has a different takeaway. The thing is, that’s why this is so important, because when running an OKR program, even if everyone reads the same book, they’re going to come away with one or two of their most important points. And if you don’t have a centralized way to run your program, to manage your resources, you’ll eventually end up running 20, 30 different OKR programs within your program, not realizing it. So it’s an area I think is really important, is making sure first and foremost that you have a centralized resource hub. We even have the Center of Excellence for that reason, to make sure that when we help work with different companies adopting OKRs, that they have the right resources but also the right format to take their experience forward.
Now, Tim, this this goes into a topic I’d love to hear your thoughts on with regards to training, because I know we talk a lot about resources, how to manage the OKR program, but how do we make sure that everyone is aligned with how to run the same program?
Tim Meinhardt:
Jeff, thank you. And first off, I loved what you had to say about the Center of Excellence. It kind of dovetails with the last piece of what we’re going to talk a little bit about today—is training. And it is, and I use the C word consistent, but you do want to have that consistency of training. And, you know, we love having a group training because it gets all those different perspectives out on the table, and people get a much deeper understanding of what goes on and their perceptions of an OKR program. So I’m going to finish here quickly. Training is something that we think is very necessary because it allows people to get that really good basis for number one, “What are OKRs? Number two, “How do I write a good OKR?” Number three, “How does all this stuff work, and what’s the program really look like?” And number four, “What’s my role and responsibility in the program? And then when I’m going into an OKR meeting how do I prepare for that? How do I make sure that I’m going to be able to accomplish this? And then if I’m on the other side, if I’m the one that’s the leader in coordinating the meeting, what does that look like as well?”
So we think that that’s a great way in order to have people get that solid foundation because again, we talked about it from the get go. The biggest issue is, so how does this all work and what’s in it for me? And so I think that training element begins to give those people those answers. And then I will say this, that when we do our training, and Jeff, you know this, that we get people super jazzed, and that’s the part that really I love about our training is to get people going, “Wow, this is really exciting. I can do this.” And so that’s where I think training is so important when you’re putting an OKR program into play and looking for that adoption because when you have that buy in, that’s a big component to OKR success.
Jeff Sweeney:
And Tim, that’s a great point. And you mentioned something right there that I think is really important to highlight that I don’t think we did enough, is inspiration, especially around training, but it really goes throughout the entire program. The nature of inspiration, of being able to create excitement, is one of the most useful tools when carving out adoption, when creating buy in, because that inspiration, especially when you’re doing it throughout training, that’s really what is ultimately going to help you in the buy in. It’s going to help not only excite people, but it’s going to have them connect better with what you’re training. So I really think being able to make sure that when you are doing training that it is inspiring, that you’re able to tell stories to be able to showcase really the success that these programs can have. Those are a huge way to make people really latch on to the OKR program and drive it forward.
Tim Meinhardt:
Absolutely. 100% agree.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
Me, too. And on that note, everyone, thank you guys so much for being on the show. I’m excited and I’m now inspired. So you guys did your job today, but thank you guys so much for being here. Until next time, everyone, to talk about the next hidden challenge. Thank you, Jeff. And thank you, Tim.
Tim Meinhardt:
Thanks, Stephanie. Thanks, Jeff.
Jeff Sweeney:
Take care, guys.
Tim Meinhardt:
Thanks so much for taking a few minutes to listen to our OKRs Q&A Podcast. You know, OKRs provide such an excellent, agile framework which is critical for today’s business needs. It’s such a pleasure to have such wonderful people share their stories and journeys with us. Please, should you ever need assistance with your OKR journey, do not hesitate to reach out to us and contact us at www.atruity1.com, and make sure if you have a minute, to rate our show. Have a great week. Stay healthy. And of course, stay happy. Thanks, everyone.
