In this exciting episode of the OKRs Q&A Podcast, Tim Meinhardt interviews the co-founders of Fitbots – Vidya Santhanam and Kashi K S. Vidya & Kashi provide some very unique insight, not only into the OKR software world, but they share their personal philosophies on what needs to be in place for OKR programs to succeed. Vidya, Kashi and Tim also discuss the proper fundamentals of an OKR program, OKR implementation best practices and what makes Fitbots OKR software so unique.
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Tim Meinhardt:
Welcome everyone to another exciting episode of the OKRs Q&A Podcast, also known as the OKR Corral, where OKR insight is the king. I’m your host, Tim Meinhardt, President and CEO of Atruity, an OKR consultancy headquartered in our nation’s capital.
Before we begin, if you’re an OKR fan and enjoy our podcast, please subscribe, leave a review, and explore our website at www.atruity1.com. And finally, should you have a burning question you’d like addressed in future episodes, please drop us a note at contact@atruity1.com.
In this exciting episode of the OKRs Q&A podcast, I have the pleasure of speaking with the co-founders of the OKR software platform Fitbots, Vidya and Kashi. Vidya and Kashi, provide some very unique insight not only into the OKR software world, but they share their personal philosophies on what needs to be in place for a successful OKR program. I really enjoy their perspective on OKRs and Vidya, Kashi, and I are aligned on almost all of the proper OKR fundamentals. This is a fabulously refreshing conversation as we talk all about OKR implementation, best practices, and what makes Fitbot’s OKR software so unique. You’ll have several key takeaways from this episode, so I recommend keeping a pen handy for all the worthwhile pieces of insight. So please grab that cup of coffee, plug in those earbuds, and enjoy my wonderful conversation with Vidya and Kashi.
So Vidya, Kashi, welcome to the program.
Kashi K S:
Hi, Tim.
Vidya Santhanam:
Thanks, Tim. Absolutely delighted to be here.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah. So Vidya, you know, this is our second podcast in a week, so our audience knows we did a wonderful podcast, both Stephanie and I, with your organization earlier this week. And so I want to make sure that everybody knows how to find your podcast. But first, tell us a little bit more about yourself and Fitbots, and Kashi please jump in here and tell us a little bit about yourself and a little bit about Fitbots as well.
Vidya Santhanam:
Great. Thanks, Tim. And we’re absolutely delighted to be on your podcast. We’ll do an introduction. My name is Vidya. I’m the CEO and co-founder of Fitbots. Started Fitbots along with my co-founder in crime, as I see, Kashi. With the aspiration of taking OKRs to companies globally. I’ve had a fairly long background in an enterprise before setting up Fitbots, worked in strategic talent management and then realized that there’s a big gap in strategy to execution, and that’s what really inspired me to set up Fitbots along with Kashi. So I’ll now hand it over to Kashi for his introduction.
Kashi K S:
Hello, everyone. My name is Kashi. I’m the co-founder and CEO of Fitbots. Prior to this, I was an enterprise architect building decision systems. What I realized in my journey of building decision systems and crunching data for leaders is that leaders look at data and dashboards, but make decisions very differently. This got me really excited to see and look at questions like, “What do leaders have in mind when they make decisions?” Explore a lot of decision driven frameworks, OKRs are the simplest of all of them. And here we go, we have set up Fitbots today [unintelligible] we have coached more than 250+ teams and build a platform along the way.
Tim Meinhardt:
Wonderful, wonderful, Kashi thank you, and Vidya thank you and before we get started, I just want to ask—what is the name? I want to make sure everybody knows the name of your podcast with you.
Vidya Santhanam:
Yeah, it’s called the Fitbots OKRs Podcast.
Tim Meinhardt:
Wonderful. Wonderful. And they can view it and find it on most, if not all the channels.
Vidya Santhanam:
Yeah, absolutely. It’s there on our website and also it’s broadcast on LinkedIn, it’s on Spotify, it’s on YouTube, Twitter. So you could actually find it in most channels, yes.
Tim Meinhardt:
Wonderful. Wonderful. I’m sure our audience would love to listen to that episode as well. All right. So we’re going to open this up a little bit. This is kind of an OKR Corral, so we’ll kind of go back and forth with everybody. And so Kashi, let me start with you. Where do you see the OKR software market evolving over the next 12 to 18 months?
Kashi K S:
I think from there we see OKR software can be bucketed into four different buckets. One is like, purely OKR software, which would cater toward probably small and medium companies. Then you have another sector of OKR software which is just focusing on performance management on OKRs, which we which we see evolve interestingly as well. And probably the third and the fourth bucket is OKRs for strategy and decision making, then we look at the OKR software market through these separate lenses. They drive multiple paradigm shifts on their own. One, the need for the thousands of startups and scale ups to have a comprehensive methodology to make data-driven decisions for enterprises. Having a way to drive digital transformation and make those strategic decisions to ever changing new worlds. And the third category is to help HR leaders probably to get out the balance between hybrid work and performance. So we find the space is exploding in multiple ways and OKRs are at the center of it.
Tim Meinhardt:
Wow, terrific, very insightful. Vidya, how would you answer this too? Anything you’d like to add?
Vidya Santhanam:
Yeah, absolutely, Tim, and I thought I’d also take the opportunity to introduce Fitbots as a company after introductions. So Fitbots is really an integrated OKR partner to companies. And the reason why we call it integrated is, yes, we have the software. But along with that, what we also do is we help teams understand what’s the value of OKRs and how to actually set up OKRs correctly. So when clients work with us, they get an end to end experience where they get an opportunity to use the software in the manner it’s intended. And one of the early realizations that Kashi and I had is it’s not only about the software, but it’s also about the experience that we’re creating around OKRs and how do we really equip teams to understand OKRs in the right manner.
So that’s just a little bit about Fitbots. We work with a bunch of companies, both scale ups, which are venture-funded startups getting into the next phase of growth, as well as mid-enterprises who are quickly adopting OKRs. So that being said, from a software perspective, I completely agree with Kashi. We find different categories of buckets, as Kashi rightly called, of OKR software. While the market is growing at 13-14% CAGR, what we really find is the evolution of OKR software is probably very similar to what Agile went through with tools like Asana many years back where the entire layer of public coaching came, and along with that the software evolved in order to help teams adopt it and put a structure to it. So that’s how we really see it evolving.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah, no, I couldn’t agree more. The realization I think you all recognize that is that, look, it’s one thing to have a piece of software, but what you really need to do is you really need to understand how a program operates and how to actually to write good, solid OKRs and then have that consistency and management quality involved and embedded in that program to make sure that you have sustainability and resiliency over the long haul. Could not agree with you more. With the marketplace, I mean, literally ever evolving and more players coming into the space of the OKR software marketplace. What are Fitbots competitive advantages and why would an organization choose Fitbots? I’ll open that up to either one of you to start.
Vidya Santhanam:
Thanks, Tim, I’ll kick it off and I’m sure Kashi would add in a lot more. So one of the ways in which we look at Fitbots from a competitive advantage perspective is the realization that you can’t really put a cart before the horse. So while, as you rightly said, software is an important and integral piece, but actually making it the heart of the OKR adoption would also involve putting the frame into place, or the structure. So for us, the value that Fitbots provides and which also is probably one of the reasons why our customers are attracted to us is because we help them get OKRs right, and not only get OKRs right from a crafting perspective, but also managing and sustaining OKRs, because one of the early questions we ask our clients is, “Are you looking at OKRs as an Ivy-League project? Then we probably may not be the best partners for you.” But if you’re really looking at it from a long-term perspective, you can take the software and here we are to help you with that layer of coaching or onboarding, you know, to get your team spun up on the process. So that’s one of the ways we differentiate. Kashi, I’m sure you’re going to add more to that.
Kashi K S:
Thanks, Vidya. I think if you really look at the way we differentiate ourselves from a pure software perspective, the way we look at OKR software is very similar to [unintelligible] as Vidya was mentioning. [Unintelligible] did not help developers code faster or run projects better. The developers have to do the job themselves. But it really takes off the workload from a management perspective to organize work and scale it with the process. What Fitbots really does is it helps engineering leaders, it helps marketing leaders and CEOs and CXOs align all their activities to the common OKRs that they have created such that they are able to make those big, hairy, audacious goals happen in a scale strategy execution so that it’s the real focus we bring with our intuitive dashboards, predictive analytics as the entire element of coaching baked into the software itself.
Tim Meinhardt:
Thank you, Kashi. Wonderful insight there. What are a couple of the largest challenges that your organization sees at Fitbots when organizations begin the implementation of OKRs? And what does your software provide to help address these challenges?
Vidya Santhanam:
Yeah, it’s really great question, Tim, and one of the ways we like to actually look at this is that when companies come over and start looking at OKRs, there are challenges at different phases. So the first challenge or the moment of truth is when they come on to the software, they see that, you know, how do I write high quality OKRs? So the way Fitbots is helping them today is we have a whole bunch of about more than 100 plus templates which are baked into the platform along with OKR writing assistance, which helps teams who are probably new or already have a basic understanding of OKRs to write OKRs with consistency. So that’s one challenge that we address very early on.
The second challenge, which we find teams actually go through, is once you set up OKRs, the next question is how do they connect in the line and how do they really see these dependencies across the organization and see which team is moving the needle and which is not, so that they can help and support each other. So the way we’ve solved it is with superior alignment boards. So our alignment boards are, I must say, you know, I’m quite proud of our alignment boards, so I call them a real beauty to look at because it’s simple and elegant and they’ve got lovely colors in it. But from the buyer perspective or the leadership team can actually get on to it and see all the connections in just a click and can see which teams are influencing and which teams are actually moving the needle directly. So these are two which I thought I’d call out and I’d like Kashi to add on from his experience with buyers as well.
Kashi K S:
Thanks Vidya. Tim, what we see when we look at Fitbots is we help leaders make data driven decisions matter. OKRs is a strategy execution framework, and when an organization is doing really well, it gives you a timeline or a history of what are the strategies that have really worked and how the OKRs have been executed, which becomes a role model for teams who are coming in later to follow. But when things don’t go really well, it’s the impact analysis that you can see from our features such as OKRs [unintelligible] the teams are doing well or not so well act as an early warning indicator to the CXOs so that they can make those decisions very early in time than wait for the impact to happen and act later. That’s a biggest for their value. Time is money for an organization and you save tremendous amount of time along with the insights we bring to the table. And that’s one of the things our customers really love about Fitbots.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah, wonderful. So, walk me into that early warning a little bit. What’s the concept behind that?
Kashi K S:
Yeah, when teams scale OKR execution, it does happen that, let’s say we have an organization OKR set which is all about scaling revenue from X, or we’ll call it $100-$400 million. To make this happen, we do require multiple teams collaborating, be it product, engineering, sales and marketing, and so forth to actually hit this revenue goal. So when each of them are working towards the same KR. It does happen that some of the teams are lagging behind, either because they lack the capability to execute, or running to hurdles which leader can intervene. So what we do is we have a feature called KRs at Risk, which on the click of a button, helps you visualize which are the KRs which aren’t doing so well and you can visualize it in that chain of events that led to this to happen which help you really make data driven decisions better.
Tim Meinhardt:
Before we continue with the interview. We’d like to tell you a little bit about Atruity.
Stephanie Meinhardt:
At Atruity we understand the challenge of implementing a successful OKR program. While the methodology may be straightforward and easy to understand, the implementation and execution of the program can seem daunting. Your team is concerned because you’re unsure how to properly implement or manage your OKR program. You are not alone. This is where Atruity comes in. We know how to implement an OKR program and are experts in OKR implementation and management. By using our proven methods and implementation structure, we can help you to successfully implement OKRs within your organization in as little as 30 days. If your organization is considering implementing OKRs or struggling with the management of the program, do not hesitate to reach out to us at contact@atruity1.com. Remember, no plan succeeds on its own—execution is everything.
Tim Meinhardt:
You know, knowing early on, and I just like the words “KRs at Risk” and there generally are a chain of events. Maybe they’re not collaborating properly, maybe they are stove piping or siloing themselves. Look, maybe they’ve had some turnover, they’ve had something happen here that’s causing some concern and so I think it’s nice within software to have that automation capability before things reach a point where somebody wakes up to say, “We do have some things are at risk.” So thank you for taking a minute here to let us know a little bit more about that. What would you recommend for organizations that are considering OKR software? Kind of walk me through your thought process there. Kashi, what do you think?
Kashi K S:
I think when organizations choose OKR software, they need to look at three simple things. So how does a connect and aligned really happen? Fundamentally, the OKR software should assist in establishing the connection between organizational goal key results and the team level key results.
The second thing, a great software which helps you visualize it, is very important. The most important thing when we look at OKR software, OKR is also cultural transformation. So the software should certainly nudge the changing culture to operating as an individual versus operating as a team. At Fitbots we take great pride in making that cultural transition from me to we throughout the course of a software. So we strongly encourage team OKRs, collaborative OKRs, and insights to help make that transition happen.
Lastly, the most important thing is organization of insight. We get a lot of data thrown at us but being able to look at the ones that are really important so that we can act when it matters the most, is really an essential component of OKR software. So, I think if they are looking at these, they’ll be able to scale and develop OKRs along with the support of OKR coaches who come along with the platform.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah, you know, the cultural concept I think is…I love that you mentioned that because I really do. And I use a team of teams when I teach and when we educate people on what really an OKR program looks like. And I love that term “me to we.” I have not heard that before. So I’ll chalk that up, put a checkmark next to that, that it was a victory today for me that I learned another term for a team of teams. So, Kashi, thank you so much. And you’re right, you know, that organizational insight really is important because you find out a lot of things once you begin to put in an OKR program, there could be gaps, there could be overlaps, like you said, there could be things underperforming. And again, it’s part of developing that culture because a good successful OKR program’s all about buy-in and getting people excited. You know, I express to people this all the time that, “look, this is just a tool, OK? You get out of it what you put into it.”
So, you know, we don’t walk into an organization and everybody is so happy, every person is so happy to say, “hey, it’s Atruity coming in. Hey, we’re going to put in this new management structure.” Quite generally, a lot of it’s the opposite feeling, you know? And so, it’s that building of that excitement and letting people know that, “look, this is a tool. Get into this a little bit, lean forward into it rather than leaning against it.” Because when that begins to happen, then you start getting that little bit of cultural shift and working that team of teams environment. And I think those things fit together naturally. And again, I think the alignment perspective that you all are mentioning, which is very elegant in your system, I think is a big deal as well because, you know, I’ll use that Team of Teams book, General McChrystal’s book Team of Teams. It’s excellent book, they talk about going from just general alignment to complex alignment where you not only have vertical alignment, which is kind of how we all think of things structurally, but you have all of these diverse horizontal alignments that maybe climbing particular or dropping down a particular level in an org chart. So that ability to see those complex OKRs in an alignment perspective is really critical to an organization.
Vidya, I know you’ve got some thoughts on this as well, so I’d love to hear what you’re thinking with regards to what are companies recommending that organizations are considering OKR software?
Vidya Santhanam:
Yeah, absolutely. Thanks, Tim. And just going back to that great example that you and Kashi just spoke about—team of teams—that’s a very powerful tool. So, when companies come over to use the software, one of the suggestions or the learnings that we share with our clients or prospective clients is that OKRs is actually helping you break organizational silos. So, when it comes to alignment, it probably would also require a shift from thinking departments, to thinking about pods or squads. Pods and squads are cross-functional teams which come together to solve a high value business problem. So in the software, teams can actually be formed if there’s a team champion or a scout who can get on to the software from the team of his or her choice, and connect the OKR to a company that will key this up.
Because what happens is, let’s say a company is working on reducing churn from 15% to 8%. Then the squad and pod can be formed, which says that we’re the churn busters and which has representation from different teams within the organization. But the eye on the prize is really I’ll be bringing company churn down and there are different ways to do it, and each member takes a different key result, so they’re all aligned. So we really like the squad way of approach because it helps break those silos. So I’d probably add to Kashi’s and your thoughts to say that yes, the software can really do that, and that’s one of the big values that we see, especially users adopting, or teams adopting an experience.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah, you know, I would absolutely agree with you that having someone there that is a champion or a scout, and sometimes they’re both with large organizations, to develop that pod and squad mentality because that’s really how you begin to solve complex. And in our world today, things are very complex. Things change in a minute from where they were or what they appeared to be just briefly, before. So I’m going to close with one question to both of you all. And Kashi, I’ll start with you first. Any last insight you would give an organization that is either considering OKRs or is in the process of looking at OKR software and what you might give them as far as insight or recommendations?
Kashi K S:
Thanks, Tim. I think organizations considering OKRs need to have two special elements. One is the ability to direct energy of all the leadership team towards committing towards the key results. And if they do that in a manner such that they can carry teams along in crafting strategy, they are more likely to succeed. The second important insight I would say is today the world is hybrid and leaders do have very little time to actually implement and scale OKRs. Having a coach along not only saves them pain, but also helps them get to OKRs right. I think this would be very important along with the software in case they are considering OKRs.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yeah, Vidya, what are your last bits of insight here that you’d love to be able to share with everyone, having been involved in this marketplace and being a founder of a software company, what’s that unique insight that you would bring to bear?
Vidya Santhanam:
In our experience, what we have observed is a sponsorship plays a great deal of difference in not only adopting, but sustaining OKRs. The software will be used by teams, OKRs will sustain as a culture and the sponsor is thinking about OKRs and making a part of his or her conversation. So to me that’s probably one of the precursors for adopting OKRs for an organization, rather than getting infatuated by other organizations who’ve actually in place and thinking that, “Yes, you know, we can do it this” when it does require commitment, it does require time and energy. But with that effort we just put in, the long-term value is immense because it really aligns teams into high value business metrics and CEO or CXO would not like that?
Tim Meinhardt:
Exactly, who would not like that? And you know, I just have to say that that this has been a wonderful podcast. I think your insight both of you today have really nailed it. And I just really want to say thank you because, you know, you’ve put things that we’ve talked about in our podcast throughout the time that we’ve actually had, that you’ve put it into your own words and some very unique thoughts on this, and I want to say thank you because I think your insight was absolutely dead on. You know, you cannot have an OKR organization get started without that right sponsorship because the road can be a little rocky at first. Hey, there is a time commitment and you need that sponsorship at the top to be able to say, “look, everything’s going to be OK, let’s put a little effort in.” Because Kashi, as you said, what you’re going to get out by putting in that effort is some really amazing stuff. And that’s really where the magic happens in companies. And I just want to thank both of you for being on the program today. And I hope that you have a fantastic spring, and I was very excited to have you all on today. And you’ve exceeded my expectations. So thank you so much for doing this for me today.
Kashi K S:
Thanks, Tim. It is a great honor talking to you and Stephanie. Look forward to keep chatting with you again.
Tim Meinhardt:
Yes. Vidya, thank you so much.
Vidya Santhanam:
Thank you, Tim, it was absolutely wonderful. And thanks for all the great questions and happy OKR-ing as we always say.
Tim Meinhardt:
Haha, really, you’re 100% right. Happy OKR-ing. Okay, everyone, have a wonderful, wonderful day.
Thanks so much for taking a few minutes to listen to our OKRs Q&A Podcast. You know, OKRs provide such an excellent, agile framework which is critical for today’s business needs. It’s such a pleasure to have such wonderful people share their stories and journeys with us. Please, should you ever need assistance with your OKR journey, do not hesitate to reach out to us and contact us at www.atruity1.com, and make sure if you have a minute, to rate our show. Have a great week. Stay healthy. And of course, stay happy. Thanks, everyone.
